Rebuild progress all in one thread

[Josh]

Finished the rear conversion to a standard 2" tube type receiver hitch. this will let me put a regular ball on, as well as the factory pintle, and the rear winch. I drilled a 5/8" receiver pin hole, for a locking, O ringed stainless steel pin, as well as a larger, 3/4" hole behind the frame for a load bearing 3/4" bolt when the winch is in. I welded a top plate above the tube, to the plate behind the frame, for some lateral support in sideways pulls

Question for you guys:

In the front, would you weld the cover plate to the hitch, or leave it bolted as-is? I dont really like the look of the gap around the tube, and, I don't see why I would ever have to remove the hitch, but, if I welded the plate to the tube, removing it could really, really suck...

Stock:


After:










SS locking pin, to deter the theves...





Bolt for load bearing when the winch is in. Camera angle makes it look crooked but it is straight:

[Master Yota]

Looks good Josh - After its painted you could always use a finger full of RVT or seam sealer to fill the gap around the hitch.

Lifer - Take a look at any automotive winch manufacturer - Warn, Ramsey, Milemarker, T-Max, Smittlybuilt, Black Mountan, and whatever others are left, and you'll notice that all thier winches pull from the bottom. They even recommend pulling from the bottom when replacing or respooling the cable. Part of "bottom pull" design as I've discovered has to do with leverage. Most winches are bottom bolted, pulling from the bottom of the drum puts less leverage on the bottom mount than pulling from the top of the drum when the winch is mounted foot down.

Most of the applications you've listed are PTO winches, (aside from the boat and car trailer) which seem to be side mounted - like the winches on our trucks - so they may use a different theory. Usually a PTO style winch has the mount inline with the drum - so you're right, pulling from top or bottom probably wouldn't matter, as the stresses on the drum are inline with the mount.

There is a big difference between the streeses on a fishing rod and a mining ore scooper. And for the record, my rod winds from the bottom, so does the winch on my boat trailer, and the winch on my car trailer, as well as the cheap chinese come-along and the good cast iron come-along in the corner of the shop.

[powerwagontim]

I just installed a Milemarker 12K electric winch on my 09 Ram 2500. It is most definately wound from the top.

[Josh]

I think you are both overlooking a big point.

One of the big reasons to wind from the bottom is that the cable will be more likely to snap downward towards the ground and absorb the energy as well.

[NebM37]

Howdy folks...

Josh it's looking better all the time...

As for the winch winding.. "correct" for the oem winch on a M37 would be from the bottom in most cases. Which direction a winch winds from is determined by the brake band orientation and if it's a right or left hand gear set, or if it's a planetary design.

The Braden MU2 was available in right or left hand gear sets. That said I have only heard of right hand sets on our vintage Dodges, so most should be wound from the bottom.

As an example the MU2 winch would be wound from the top. Hope this helps in some small way.

Norm

[Brett]

Have you considered reinforcing that crossmember? I seem to recall hearing of more than one truck having it bent from pulling stumps or whatever. I think if you got that truck stuck pretty good, and had 12k lbs of pull it would buckle pretty quick. the pintle mount was only designed to pull a couple thousand pounds of trailer. the lifting rings were for recovery. Then again we have to stop somewhere or we end up with 20K lb trucks

Brett

[Josh]

Brett,

I agree, I doubt it would take 6 tons of pull as well, but, I'm not sure what to do about it. If the fuel tank wasn't in the way, it would make it much easier. I was thinking of cutting some 1/4"X4" plate and putting it on the top and bottom at a 45* angle so that it joins into the frame rails, but, then taking the gas tank out for any work would really really suck, but, not as much as buckling the frame would suck, so, I'm debating... haha!

[Josh]

Howdy folks...

Josh it's looking better all the time...

As for the winch winding.. "correct" for the oem winch on a M37 would be from the bottom in most cases. Which direction a winch winds from is determined by the brake band orientation and if it's a right or left hand gear set, or if it's a planetary design.

The Braden MU2 was available in right or left hand gear sets. That said I have only heard of right hand sets on our vintage Dodges, so most should be wound from the bottom.

As an example the MU2 winch would be wound from the top. Hope this helps in some small way.

Norm

Norm, all good points. I dont think the Ramsey's I have are gonna care, as the worm gearset in them is a low helix angle, self locking set, so there is no brake on the drum like a higher angle non locking gearset, as was used in the LU-4, but, a very valid point, nonetheless.

[Brett]

Is your receiver short enough that you can remove it from the crossmember with the tank in place. If so maybe you could add some structure that was part of the hitch, so you could remove it all to facilitate droping the tank. That would also keep it looking relatively correct from the outside

Brett

[Master Yota]

Josh - your point on the cable snapping downward is probably the best reason to wind a winch from the bottom. When all else fails, safety first. I'm willing to concede that winches can be wound either way, with variable mechanical factors deciding the final action.

As for you're hitch dilema - IMS the fuel tank is mounted flush with the bottom of the frame rails correct? Could you not incorporate a gas tank "skidplate that bolted down the rails and accross the rear member to support pulling duties? You'd end up with tank protection and a beefier rear ( )...

Might just be the easiest solution to your worries?

[Josh]

a bit more progress. Finished the pintle hitch conversion. Will work on the winch tonight. Sandwiched a plate between the two factory plates, then bolted it all together, then welded the body to the plate between the two. can still get to the grease zerk from underneath, and it still swivels.











Also worked out what to do for ignition. Read up on ignition KV as it relates to cylinder pressure. Under a bar of boost, I will have equivalent cylinder pressures to 245 or so PSI, not including the volume occupied by the fuel, but, also not taking into account leakdown and such, so, it's probably pretty close. at 245 PSI, you need 21KV to fire a plug with a .030 gap. Reason I looked into this is I have these very nice, very FREE coils:



Problem is, said coils only output 15KV, so, I am out of luck.

I'll instead be running GM LS2 coils:



these output 45-50KV, have a dwell time of only 5 mS, and output 150mJ of energy at the plug. Basically, they are 2-3 times more powerful than a normal distributed V8 coil, and could probably fire a spark plug under 15 PSI of boost with a .040 or possibly bigger gap!

[Josh]

Rear winch mount is done:









Barely clears the stock bumperettes, but, its good!



the business end:

[Master Yota]

Just for thought - I've seen single point winch mounts - like yours - bend when pulling off center (which is usually the case as tree's or anchors aren't usually in the middle of the road!).

I don't know if its feasable to design something to distribute the load against the bumperette's or something like that. But it is something to be aware of...

Otherwise, nice job as usuall!

[Josh]

Ray, good point. I'll think some on it. I need to do as it was suggested above and reinforce the crossbar the hitch is on, as with that much of a moment arm, If I put my 210 lbs of lard on the winch, I can see the crossmember torsionally flex. I think I'll Make a skidpan that covers the entire fuel tank, and ties the rear crossmember into the sides of the frame.

What can't be seen in my pictures are two big 12" triangular pieces of steel welded on the top and bottom of the tube that slides inti the receiver. These plates are then welded to the crossbar on the back of the winch, so, it has a pretty hefty gusset to cut down on bending of the hitch itself, but, that factory rear crossmember worries me...

[Master Yota]

Ain't leverage a PIA?