Be careful when sourcing parts locally

MSeriesRebuild · Post by **MSeriesRebuild** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 9:42 am

I learned yesterday that NAPA has a new line of universal joints available. This new line has taken over the on shelf items in our local store. I sent after some for a M715 brush fire truck the other day, came back with a strange looking box. Upon a closer investigation, there it was "made in China." The new name is NAPA Performer u-joints. We have used Precision u-joints from NAPA for years, great product. I called back to inquire if they had dropped the precision line, was told the Precision joints are still available, but overnight order, no longer on the shelf. The new more attractively priced line is now the standard on shelf joints for NAPA. The difference in the numbering system is that the cheap Chinese joints have a "P" prefix added to the number, (example: the joint I needed was a Precision# 369, the Chinese model was P369.) I ordered the 369's & returned the P369's. Just one more item we'll have to pre-order from now on to get the best quality joint. We make every effort not to use the cheap stuff in our rebuilds, getting harder to do though. Difference in cost was around $4.

W_A_Watson_II · Post by **W_A_Watson_II** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 2:37 pm

Napa has lost it's luster with me as well. Their web site has never been great, but I can't even find a part on it any more. I've started using O'Rielly these days.

Wayne64 · Post by **Wayne64** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 6:19 pm

Sad state of affairs. I try very hard to buy quality and USA if possible, just got stung again. Bought a Draw-Tite ball x pintle hitch through the mail. My fault as I figured American company right. The hitch was made in China

Lifer · Post by **Lifer** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 4:14 am

I was listening to the 6-o'clock news this morning, and they were talking about the need for better education...especially for boys...in the US today. Their main point was that the traditional "alternative" career options of farming and manufacturing jobs no longer exist in this country, thus demanding kids who can use their brains instead of their hands.

The way I see it, we need both! Every country in the world needs "hard" goods. Why can't we make our own instead of shipping the jobs off to some third-world country and then importing their poorly made products? Free trade is okay, to a point, but if we put a hefty import duty on the cheap crap, people would be more willing to pay the little bit more for a quality America-made product. Educationally speaking, we need kids who can think to design useful products and the eqipment with which to make them, and we need kids who are good with their hands to build and maintain them.

I could go on and on about our "throw it away instead of fixing it" way of thinking in America, but I think y'all get my point.

End of rant!

powerwagontim · Post by **powerwagontim** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 5:02 am

Hi Lifer,
I agree. I am a remodeling contractor and often the kids who come looking for work are real losers who dont really have an interest in learning the building trade but need a job for beer money. Why arent the bright and motivated kids coming into the trades? Cause it isnt "cool" to be a plumber or a carpenter. The average age of a carpenter is somewhere in the 50s, which I find scary.
On the "Made in America" debate, I bought a vacuum gauge last week, that was made in America. When I got it back to the shop I noticed the needle was at 10 pounds of pressure instead of zero. I tried twanging on the side, and the needle vibrated but always came right back to 10. Ended up getting one at Sears, nicely indexed at 0, and guess where it was made? China. So, not everything made here is going to be perfect!
Tim

MSeriesRebuild · Post by **MSeriesRebuild** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 7:39 am

Lifer & tim, both of you share with much knowledge, I see the same stuff regularly. My daughter's boy friend is one in 10 milion, loves mechanic work with a passion. Will be graduating high school in the spring, has a job for summer already lined up at the local John Deere Dealer's service dept. Will be starting into a 2-year program in the fall at Wake Tech near Raleigh, NC as a student sponsered by John Deere. Has a guaranteed job at the end of 2-years certified in both farm machinery & heavy construction equipment. Based on what I've seen, he is certainly the exception to the rule these days. He comes to our shop & just looks on with great anticipation at what we do, the only young person that has ever done that. His Dad was a technician at Caterpillar for years & later opened up his own heavy equipment service facility which was growing by leaps & bounds into a huge service & used equipment sales facility. He was killed tragically in a motor cycle accident 3 years ago. The Company still lives on today, however sadly the 2 sons are not a part of it as a result of legal matters. The cause of the accident, a rusted, broken bolt on the kick stand assembly that failed allowing the assembly to drop down causing him to lose control of the bike. One more reason, never leave anything untouched during a restoration.

Where are the bright young kids that should be stepping up? I wonder that also, I don't see it happening in our area. My son is a body tech here at M Series, his buddies ask him what do we do at our shop? Is it a service facility where you change oil in vehicles & stuff like that? When he tells them that we are a full body off rebuild/restoration facility, the reply he gets most often, oh gosh I wouldn't want to do all that. Working with your hands just ain't cool these days. I don't know where it may lead, looks to me like no where fast except to a welfare economy. Based on this, I'm not surprized at all about the incorrectly calibrated gauge that was a USA product. It was likely inspected by a kid who would really rather be somewhere else. I'm afraid what we see now is only the beginnings of things to come as America's education system continues to turn out folks who don't know much of anything except it ain't cool to work. I recall when I was in school, being taught to have ambition was as big as learning reading, writing, & math, the simple basics that have served me well. My son now age 22 took 2-years of carpentry in high school. I learned when he came to work here that he didn't have a clue about reading fractions on a tape measure. Tim, how does one do carpenter work without being able to read a tape measure? I still ask Steven that question now & again, never have gotten an answer to the question though. I think I've figured it out on my own, if the fraction is smaller than 1/2", don't worry about it, cover the gap with a wider piece of moulding. It was simply too much trouble to measure correctly & cut to fit for a neat job. He has had to learn here that theory just doesn't flush at M Series.

Franz© · Post by **Franz©** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 1:07 pm

Where are the bright young kids who should be stepping up you ask.

That is a question I can and will answer, and the answer will scare you. Look at the large pool of young man particularly who got fed up with the bullshyt in High School and walked away from Public "Education". That's right, the DROPOUTS! That group contains some of the best and brightest there are, and they want to learn.

I started mining the pool back in the late 80s, and built many successful tradesmen. I got so good at it my compeditors were trying to steal my people. They couldn't because my people were taught loyalty along with why business runs the way it does.

The best & brightest are not coming from the colleges in 2009. The colleges have become remedial high schools, and the high schools are wastelands. The best run for their sanity in many cases today.

MSeriesRebuild · Post by **MSeriesRebuild** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 1:47 pm

I believe in many cases you are right,

obxron · Post by **obxron** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 3:58 pm

My son was becoming a victim of public school education. A year ago he was ready to call it quits, he wasn't learning anything because the teachers spent most of class time trying to get the other animals to settle down. He wanted to go to work with me instead to learn my trade but we wanted him to go further than that. We all decided to try military school. Man what a change ,now he is talking about college or university,possible career in the military or for the state in game and fisheries department. It is costing a bunch but now he able to understand and appreciate the importance of education and he is doing quite well.

There once was a time when young people took pride in their selves, their communities and their country. Now its about the "bling" ,the easy money, myspace and slacking as much as possible. A good reason to bring back the draft, that would shake up the younger generation and possibly get them to start thinking a little clearer. If the system or parents can't train them hopefully the military could. I know if the draft had been around when I was 18 it would have gotten me squared away alot sooner than it took me to do it.

As for quality of american goods, that left when everything went to China and all other points east and south. I hate to buy things that are made by communist regimes or in third world countries but sometimes there is no choice. Welcome to post-industrial America

mattveeder · Post by **mattveeder** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 2:02 pm

I think that it is a shame that napa is doing this. They are one of the last real parst stores near me. The others are filled with kids who know how to use a computer and nothing about cars. And to make it worse they sell crap for parts. Next napa will do the same.

Lifer · Post by **Lifer** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 8:02 pm

Franz© wrote: The colleges have become remedial high schools, and the high schools are wastelands.

I can certainly attest to that! I waited until after retiring from the Air Force before going to college to become an English teacher. Believe me when I say that I did not learn anything in my major field that I had not mastered by 8th grade! I continue to be astounded by the people with graduate and post-graduate degrees who cannot construct a simple sentence or spell anything but the most common monosyllabic words! It scares me to death to think that some of them will be drafting legislation in years to come!

Josh · Post by **Josh** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 8:05 pm

I'm 25, so, I'm right in that generation you guys are bagging on, and, youre right...

I'm one of the few of my age group that's pulled my shit together and has it working...

I'm a degreed engineer, with a home, and a stable relationship, I pay my taxes, don't drink, don't smoke, and, one sad fact, won't have kids. My parent's generation, as well as mine, has done a great job screwing everything up, so, I refuse to have them. It used to be the american dream was a good job, house, and family... now, thats the american requirement. Everyone thinks they're entitled to it, and they're NOT. This place is going down the tubes, and I refuse to subject my kids to it.

The biggest problem is personal responsibility. No one is responsible for anything they do any more...They pop a pill, or blame someone else, or sue someone, or ask for a hand out from the government. My fiancee and I bought a 100K dollar house... The bank approved me for 200K, but, I had more sense then they did, and knew I could only comfortably afford 1/2 that!! Unfortunately, most people expect others to think for them, and wont use their heads.

Another fact: Kids from foreign nations have alot more drive and ambition then most kids here. All of the Ph.D's, and Masters degreed kids are from somewhere else...

And, to make matters worse, you can't get any kind of job working with your hands without having some sort of certification. I tried to get a Job at a Jiffy lube once... pulled up in the M, with the V8 and drivetrian swap, 1/2 way through my engineering program, and, they refused, because I wasn't SAE certified... but, the grease monkey in there in the pit that doesnt know a box end wrench from a phillips screw driver has a slip of paper, so he's good to go...

Just my observations...

HingsingM37 · Post by **HingsingM37** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 3:50 am

It is more than alarming the curent state of things. I encounter so much stupidity from customers and vendors on a daily basis. This week I had a customer (an established MFG firm in NE Ohio) request a 12VDC wiring harness. 10 14 ga wires total. 109" long with loom. Rocker switch and relay. Very simple. High school technical drawing level.
My vendor came up with a basic drawing to have the customer approve for a prototype. I get an email from the customer that they do not understand the drawing. I asked "What do you not understand, did I get your request wrong?" I wondered. "Please indicate where you feel I made a mistake so I can correct it". I get a response "No, I am sure your drawing is fine, none of us here know how to read it."
Goodyear, who once rolled a Corsair off the assembly line every 8 minutes, cannot get a NDA shipment out reliably. Timken (who bought Fafnir and destroyed it)now quotes a year lead time for precision spindle bearings that are in half of the CNC machines in the US. If we had to tool up for a big war effort we would be sunk

Inventory levels are non-existent, if we had to pull ships or aircraft out of mothballs, there would be no service bearings.
Last year I had to explain to an 8 year old how to read a second hand on a analog clock. Question is, what will we do about this all?

refit1701 · Post by **refit1701** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 4:28 am

Nothing until a majority have had enough. When you "dumb down" everyone to the same level instead of improving the intelligence of the population, you get mediocrity and eventually slavery. No one will be smart enough to realize what is happening until it is too late.

I think some are beginning to wake up now, with the current runaway state of our government caretakers, but is it too late?

Will it require a politician hanging from every lamp post to get the message across?

N1VSM · Post by **N1VSM** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 9:08 am

Franz© wrote:Look at the large pool of young man particularly who got fed up with the bullshyt in High School and walked away from Public "Education".

That includes some our best & brightest teachers, too. Like me.