JimC wrote:The jeep T18's had the PTO on the driver's side. I forget which years also had the 6.32 gearing.
Avoid the cathedral bowl Holley at all cost.
I would keep the stock ring and pinion with this engine because it was my experience that the small block V8 in my 37 didn't produce enough torque to get the job done even with stock gearing. I think after you run in the field, you'll wind up wanting at least 400 cubic inches. That was my experience when I went through all this back in the 60's.
What were you using for a small block? I only ask as my first M37 had an HO305 and SM465 combo and it would almost carry a tire across an intersection with stock diffs. If my 305 was making 200hp I'd be amazed, but the drivability was so much better over the flathead that it made driving under any circumstances so much more fun.
Could your experience Jim be explained by anything other than it just being a small block? I'm thinking cam choice, or failing clutch, or any other issue that could have influenced your choice to go to a bigger engine? Or is it just the old adage of "there is no substitution for cubic inches..."
It was a freshly overhauled 318 with a good clutch. Inadequate in soft sand. No substitute for cubic inches.
I also had a '62 Navy crew cab Power Wagon with a Slant Six, and I eventually wound up using the 318 in that after I removed it from the 37. The 318 was a lot better than the 230, just not enough ummph for a heavy truck.
As an aside, the SM465 is my favorite transmission.
I'll give props to the 465 as well, I loved mine too. Although I'd be hard pressed to find any argument with my current NP435, its shifts beautifully with nothing but a slight "click" between gears. My SM465 seemed to have a slightly shorter throw on it though, either that or the shifter was shorter...
thanks for the discussion guys.
I think I'm going to get a tubular universal K-member to mount this thing. I think it will be a lot easier than building my own motor mounts. http://www.jegs.com/i/Trans-Dapt/969/4849/10002/-1
For under $100 on amazon it seems like it will save a lot of time and effort trying to mount the motor. They also have a universal tranny x-member if I can't adapt the existing one.
The biggest problem is making everything clear your front pumpkin and the front drive line. Installing additional cross members may make that a lot more difficult. I installed a 318 in one long weekend, and a year later, a bb Chevy in another long weekend, both by attaching the motor mounts to the frame rails with L-shaped brackets. It has been my experience that that is the easiest way.
I suggest you pull your transmission hump, your transmission, your engine and your radiator.
Assemble your new engine, bell housing, and transmission on the floor of the garage.
Lift and slide them in place using an engine hoist and a couple of floor jacks on wheels.
Adjust the angle and positioning of the assembly so that your transmission hump goes back in the original position, the rear of the engine clears the firewall, the oil pan clears the pumpkin, the exhausts clear the framerails with enough clearance to allow the engine to move a little bit under acceleration and downshifting, the air filter will clear the hood, the jackshaft angle between the transmission and transfer is well-aligned, and the PTO location aligns with the winch jackshaft hole in the front cross member. This typically takes a couple of hours and generally winds up with the engine cocked a little bit to clear the front pumpkin when the front springs are fully compressed on the passenger side and fully extended on the driver's side. It's easier to do than to describe.
Once you are happy with the location of everything, either bolt or weld brackets to the frame rails for mounting your side motor mounts, I strongly recommend also placing a front motor mount at the front cross member.
I just attached an extension on the bottom of the clutch pedal to reverse its direction of travel and used it to drive a hydraulic clutch. Didn't alter the clutch pedal or brake pedal mounting or travel.
no PTO to worry about so that is out, and the K-members that I've seen just go underneath the engine in front of the sump, so they wouldn't get in the way, but still have to find the right transmission first... Found a 2wd ZF5 that the guy is claiming will fit the V10/5.4L. Thought those got the ZF6 with a new bellhousing pattern... http://maine.craigslist.org/pts/4266794224.html
That's obviously not a M37, but it is a ZF5 bolted to the back of a 4bt and there are quite a few build threads with the ZF5/4bt combo so I don't see why it wouldn't work with the 351
I am not sure where the engine is actually going to sit until I have a transmission to see where everything is going to line up, but the K member I posted above stays inline with the motor mounts so where it ends up in relation to the pumpkin depends on how far back the engine can sit. Farther back the better obviously.
The front pumpkin on my first M37 with the SBC in it did some mild self clearancing of the oil pan on its own after installation, so I can confirm that there isn't enough room for anything resembling a cross member to pass between the oil pan/diff area with sufficient clearance at stock height. The 351 oil pan may be different, but I wouldn't bet the farm on it.
The process that Jim has laid out is a good way to visualize how the engine will sit in the engine bay, and make sure all the bases are covered for clearance. You will need to put a new hole in the trans-hump cover for the shifter. If you try to keep the shifter in the stock position, the engine will be too far forward. Basic rule of thumb is to have an inch of clearance between the motor and firewall, and a minimum of 1.25" between the leading edge of the fan blades and the radiator (to accommodate the blades flexing forward under load). You will also have to shorten the spud shaft between the tcase and transmission, as the 5spd is inherently longer than the 4spd... If you need to make up or remove any length from the driveline, do it in the spud shaft first. Its the easiest item to make longer or shorter.
The spud in my M37 is less than 10" long; its basically just the splined portion of a driveshaft, with just enough tube to weld the yoke to the male end of the slip-spline.
no worries with mechanical fan, going to 2spd electric fan from a Volvo so it is going to be shoved as far back as it can go. Good to know the Kmember is out, will go tradition motor mounts. Have to do a boat load of measuring once the front clip is off of the truck. Thought about using adjustable swap bar end links for motor mounts depending on spacing, but won't know until I get everything taken apart for measuring
The shifter hole is pretty good sized. I didn't have to move it for the 318. I moved it about half an inch for the bb.
I was trying to say as tactfully as I know how, there is no room to add a cross member. It would be higher than the oilpan, and you'd have to remove the crankshaft in order to make room for it to fit. I don't see much purpose in installing an engine with no crankshaft
I did NOT remove the front clip for either engine installation. Only the radiator came out. Having the front clip in place helped me position the engine and keep it low enough to clear the hood. I didn't do any measuring on either installation. I just put the engine where it would fit and welded the supports for the engine mounts in place from the bottom side.
Last edited by JimC on Tue Jan 28, 2014 7:50 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Just on the side, Electric fans work best with radiators designed for electric fans. Most electric fans can't pull enough air through a conventional rad that was originally cooled with a direct drive, or clutch driven mechanical fan. The mechanical fan moves far more air than an electric, so the design of the rad must accommodate this short coming. Most radiators that are cooled by an e-fan are usually single or dual core, with fewer fins between the tubes to allow more air volume to easily pass through the rad.
You'll have to allow for even more space between the engine and rad with the electric setup, as you'll have to plan for the thickness of the electric motor (clearance between the motor and water pump snout) and any shrouding that usually comes with an E-fan.
I'm old school, I prefer a mech. fan for primary cooling, and then a supplementary electric fan mounted out front as a pusher to help on those really hot days.
Home 
