Starter Out! Lessons learned:

[rtquig]

Finally!! Unscrewed the oil dip stick - thanks guys!, had to take off 2 copper fittings from the distributor, one is connected to a copper line other is plugged. Still didn't have enough room to get the starter out so I threatened to put a match to the truck and it finally gave it up. Probably didn't need to take up the floor panels but I might still need it open to put it back in.
The problem, and I'm guessing the starter didn't have to come out ,was the spring on top was stuck pushed in and gunked up with grease and paint. I went to Autozone and bought electric parts cleaner and a can of WD-40, took apart the assy and cleaned it out good with the spray using a tooth brush and it looks good, was dirty and had a little dried grease or dirt inside. After cleaning the spring moves in and out with ease. The gear on the starter looks good, moves freely. Now I want to test it before putting it back in but my batteries are dead and I have to buy new ones (they were left without the tenders for too long. Can I use a battery charger/starter from work to test the starter? It has a 6, 12 and 24 volt range on it.
While I had the starter out I noticed the main battery cable had a crack in the rubber, but I have a new one from rewiring the main system so I do that next before attempting to put the starter back in.
Thanks for all the help, I'm sure I'll have more questions along the way. I want to take my time so I don't see it running by the weekend or two but I do want it back on the road soon.
Rich

[Cal_Gary]

Your charger should work, in order to spin the starter since it has a 24V option.
Gary

[rtquig]

Thanks Gary.

[Joe]

I don't think your battery charger will provide anywhere near enough current to operate the starter AND the high current may damage the charger. I won't try it! You can test the charger with a 12volt battery since the kick-in is manual instead of via a selenoid. It should spin but just slower.

Haven't tried it but that's my opinion.

[MSeriesRebuild]

Finally!! Unscrewed the oil dip stick - thanks guys!, had to take off 2 copper fittings from the distributor, one is connected to a copper line other is plugged. Still didn't have enough room to get the starter out so I threatened to put a match to the truck and it finally gave it up. Probably didn't need to take up the floor panels but I might still need it open to put it back in.
The problem, and I'm guessing the starter didn't have to come out ,was the spring on top was stuck pushed in and gunked up with grease and paint. I went to Autozone and bought electric parts cleaner and a can of WD-40, took apart the assy and cleaned it out good with the spray using a tooth brush and it looks good, was dirty and had a little dried grease or dirt inside. After cleaning the spring moves in and out with ease. The gear on the starter looks good, moves freely. Now I want to test it before putting it back in but my batteries are dead and I have to buy new ones (they were left without the tenders for too long. Can I use a battery charger/starter from work to test the starter? It has a 6, 12 and 24 volt range on it.
While I had the starter out I noticed the main battery cable had a crack in the rubber, but I have a new one from rewiring the main system so I do that next before attempting to put the starter back in.
Thanks for all the help, I'm sure I'll have more questions along the way. I want to take my time so I don't see it running by the weekend or two but I do want it back on the road soon.
Rich

Rich, in the first line of your first paragragh above, I noticed you said your distributor has 2 brass fittings, one with a tube connected, 1 plugged. These would be the vent lines from the intake elbow to the distributor. You need to remove the plug and get another line in place, hooked up correctly with the correct fittings on the intake elbow. If the distributor does not have circulating air through these vent tubes, you have other issues close on your trail. No ventilation will kill coils as fast as you can change them out.

[rtquig]

Charles,
I do have 2 lines with copper tubes connected, one is in the front towards the radiator and the other is on the side with the starter. On the one with the side towards the starter there is a plugged brass fitting also.
I got impatient today and put 12 volt connection to the starter while on the bench. The bendix spins and slides up to the end of the starter. I only did this for a few seconds but it seems to work fine.
I called the place that was rebuilding my other starter and he is waiting for the epoxy coating to dry, but said the assy is burnt out and he can't test the starter, doesn't know if the epoxy will hold but its $80. so far.

Reading the forum posts, I have seen the civilian battery for the M 37 is the 22nf. Does anyone know if these are deep cycle also?

[MSeriesRebuild]

Charles,
I do have 2 lines with copper tubes connected, one is in the front towards the radiator and the other is on the side with the starter. On the one with the side towards the starter there is a plugged brass fitting also.
I got impatient today and put 12 volt connection to the starter while on the bench. The bendix spins and slides up to the end of the starter. I only did this for a few seconds but it seems to work fine.
I called the place that was rebuilding my other starter and he is waiting for the epoxy coating to dry, but said the assy is burnt out and he can't test the starter, doesn't know if the epoxy will hold but its $80. so far.

Reading the forum posts, I have seen the civilian battery for the M 37 is the 22nf. Does anyone know if these are deep cycle also?

The plugged fitting is the oil reservoir for the top shaft bushing. The way your other post read, sounded like you only had 1 tube and 1 fitting plugged. The reservoir plug should be removed at least at every oil change and the elbow filled with engine oil. That is the only oil the top bushing ever gets as it does not receive oil from the engine like the bottom bushing does.

[rtquig]

Thats good to know, the elbow was filled with what looked like grease. I plan on an oil change very soon, and will put oil in the elbow. I also want to clean out the housing for the oil filter as the first oil change there was a lot of sludge in there.

[MSeriesRebuild]

Thats good to know, the elbow was filled with what looked like grease. I plan on an oil change very soon, and will put oil in the elbow. I also want to clean out the housing for the oil filter as the first oil change there was a lot of sludge in there.

Clean out the grease before adding oil.

Grease in there is actually a worst enemy. There is a felt wick in there, approx 1/4" in diameter and about 1.5" long. You'll need to remove the plug/elbow assy, pull the wick out with tweezers (it will be a snug fit) and clean out all the grease; aerosol brake cleaner and an air blow gun works well for cleaning the housing and elbow. Clean the wick with solvent and get it completely dry. Put some engine oil in a small container, drop the wick in the oil and allow it to soak up all it will hold. After this process is complete, replace the wick in the housing. Use thread sealer on elbow threads, then install the elbow into the housing being sure the plug port opening is oriented correctly as you tighten the elbow. You want the elbow plug opening to be pointing straight up when the distributor is installed in the engine block; this will allow for easy oil filling at future routine maintenace intervals. Fill the elbow with engine oil using a pump oiler to the point of plug depth. Use thread sealer on the plug, install, and tighten. At every oil change, remove the plug and fill the elbow with engine oil. This will keep oil on the top shaft bushing constantly, and will make a drastic difference in how long your distributor will offer you trouble free service.

Using grease as top bushing lube is another screw up straight from the military manual right along with many others. It simply does not work in the application; oil will flow where grease will never tread, and provides far better lubrication here. We have rebuilt many military distributors; without fail in every case where we find grease used as a top bushing lube, we find a worn top bushing, grease just doesn't work here. You need to check yours to see that the shaft is not loose in the bushing before proceeding. If the shaft is loose already; the bushings will need to be replaced and reamed to size (.501"), a total rebuild is the best fix; then use the proper lube to keep it in good shape for a long service life. The bottom bushing oils from the engine. Also be sure to service the oil seal at the same time as you don't want oil getting into the distributor internals.

[rtquig]

Once again, thank you Charles. I would not have known about any of that. Since its a rainy day, I might spend the afternoon working on the truck unless my wife has other ideas.

[SOTVEN]

Thats good to know, the elbow was filled with what looked like grease. I plan on an oil change very soon, and will put oil in the elbow. I also want to clean out the housing for the oil filter as the first oil change there was a lot of sludge in there.

Clean out the grease before adding oil.

Grease in there is actually a worst enemy. There is a felt wick in there, approx 1/4" in diameter and about 1.5" long. You'll need to remove the plug/elbow assy, pull the wick out with tweezers (it will be a snug fit) and clean out all the grease; aerosol brake cleaner and an air blow gun works well for cleaning the housing and elbow. Clean the wick with solvent and get it completely dry. Put some engine oil in a small container, drop the wick in the oil and allow it to soak up all it will hold. After this process is complete, replace the wick in the housing. Use thread sealer on elbow threads, then install the elbow into the housing being sure the plug port opening is oriented correctly as you tighten the elbow. You want the elbow plug opening to be pointing straight up when the distributor is installed in the engine block; this will allow for easy oil filling at future routine maintenace intervals. Fill the elbow with engine oil using a pump oiler to the point of plug depth. Use thread sealer on the plug, install, and tighten. At every oil change, remove the plug and fill the elbow with engine oil. This will keep oil on the top shaft bushing constantly, and will make a drastic difference in how long your distributor will offer you trouble free service.

Using grease as top bushing lube is another screw up straight from the military manual right along with many others. It simply does not work in the application; oil will flow where grease will never tread, and provides far better lubrication here. We have rebuilt many military distributors; without fail in every case where we find grease used as a top bushing lube, we find a worn top bushing, grease just doesn't work here. You need to check yours to see that the shaft is not loose in the bushing before proceeding. If the shaft is loose already; the bushings will need to be replaced and reamed to size (.501"), a total rebuild is the best fix; then use the proper lube to keep it in good shape for a long service life. The bottom bushing oils from the engine. Also be sure to service the oil seal at the same time as you don't want oil getting into the distributor internals.

CHARLES, ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE AIR INTAKE ELBOW? I NEVER FOUND A WICK IN THERE. AND INDEED MY DISTRIBUTOR SHAFT WAS STUCK AT SOME POINT. CAN YOU PLEASE UPLOAD A PICTURE OF WHICH DISTRIBUTOR LINE GETS THE WICK? AND UP TO WHAT LEVEL DOES THE ELBOW GET FILLED WITH OIL? THANKS

[MSeriesRebuild]

Has nothing to do with vent lines or intake elbow.

This is a 1/8" NPT street elbow with a 1/8" NPT plug in it on the right side of the distributor housing. This is totally separate from the vent system.

[SOTVEN]

Has nothing to do with vent lines or intake elbow.

This is a 1/8" NPT street elbow with a 1/8" NPT plug in it on the right side of the distributor housing. This is totally separate from the vent system.

ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT A SMALL BRONZE PLUG SOMEWHERE ON THE LOWER HALF OF THE ALUMINUM DISTRIBUTOR BODY?

[MSeriesRebuild]

Has nothing to do with vent lines or intake elbow.

This is a 1/8" NPT street elbow with a 1/8" NPT plug in it on the right side of the distributor housing. This is totally separate from the vent system.

ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT A SMALL BRONZE PLUG SOMEWHERE ON THE LOWER HALF OF THE ALUMINUM DISTRIBUTOR BODY?

Should be a bronze street el with a bronze plug in it.

[SOTVEN]

Has nothing to do with vent lines or intake elbow.

This is a 1/8" NPT street elbow with a 1/8" NPT plug in it on the right side of the distributor housing. This is totally separate from the vent system.

ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT A SMALL BRONZE PLUG SOMEWHERE ON THE LOWER HALF OF THE ALUMINUM DISTRIBUTOR BODY?

Should be a bronze street el with a bronze plug in it.

HMMMM.... EITHER MY DISTRIBUTOR IS MISSING PARTS, OR I CAN NOT REMEMBER DETAILS