wanna run something past you guys...

[98taco3]

I have a chance to get ahold of an engine and transmission setup out of a 2010 Jeep Rubicon most likely for a very good price. The engine has 3k miles on it and includes everything from radiator to the wiring harness/computers. It got me thinking about swapping it into the m37. Its no V8 but should have heaps more power than the old tired flatty and fuel injection would be really nice to have offroad. I was just wondering what you guys thought about the swap. Shouldnt be to bad, only issue would be making the engine run stand alone and supplying fuel to the engine at the correct pressure. Coolest thing is its still 230ci and it keeps it in the mopar family Any thoughts?

[k8icu]

Would you be swapping the transfer case? If so then you'll have a whole kettle of fish as the Jeep was a drivers side drop to the front axle and the Dodge is a passinger sided drop to the the front. If you talking engine and transmission then you will have to find a way to hook to the NP200 transfercase in the Dodge because the transfer on the Jeep is direct bolted to the transmission. Auto or stick transmission? The point is that it's not a plug and play swap. Your going to have to figure out a few things along the way. Anything is possible with the right amount of time and money.

[SOTVEN]

QUITE TRUE, TIME AND MONEY CAN FIX EVERYTHING. A FRIEND OF MINE TRANSPLANTED EFI ENGINE, TRANNY, TRANSFER, AXLES, P/S AND AIRCONDITIONING!!! FROM A 200-SOMETHING CHEROKEE TO HIS 1949 WILLYS WAGON. EVERYTHING HAS BEEN WORKING GOOD SO FAR. I WAS CONSIDERING ONCE GOING WITH THE JEEP 4.0 INLIVE SIX/MANUAL TRANNY FOR MY M. BUT I FIGGURED, "IF I AM GOING TO GO THROUGH ALL THAT HASSLE, I D BETTER MAKE THE MOST OF IT" SO I WILL BE GOING WITH A 360 V8. WILL THE V 6 HAVE MORE POWER THAN THE STOCK 230? ACCORDING TO THE MANUFACTURER'S SPECS, PROBABLY MORE THAN TWICE THE POWER. WILL THE TRANNY/ TRANSFER STAND UP TO THE NEED TO HAUL THE HEAVY M37? THERE I AM SCEPTICAL, SINCE I HAVE NO ADDEQUATE DATA. I KNOW THAT THE RUBICON WAS THE MOST "OFFRAD" OF ALL NEW WRANGLERS, WITH SPECIAL SHOCKS AND 4:1 LOW TRANSFER. YET IT REMAINS A JEEP, AND THE M IS A 3/4 TON TRUCK. IT WILL PROBABLY BE ENOUGH TO JUST DRIVE AROUND (I HAVE SEEN A WC51 WITH A M-B 2.4L 4 BANGER DIESEL AND 4 SPEED FROM A PASSENGER CAR) BUT IF YOU INTEND TO LOAD THE TRUCK OR DRIVE OFFROAD WILL THE TRANNY/ TRANSFER HOLD TOGETHER? IF NOT, COULD YOU MATE THE ENGINE TO THE STOCK TRANNY AND RETAIN THE REST OF THE DRIVETRAIN? PERSONALLY. I THINK MY WORST THING TO OVERCOME IN YOUR CASE WOULD BE TO SORT OUT ALL THE WIRES INVOLVED FOR THE EFI COMPUTERS, RATHER ANYTHING ELSE YOU ARE GOING TO FACE. I AM SORT OF TERRIFIED WITH COMPUTER WIRES (AND MEDICINE NEEDLES LOL) I LIKE THE MOPAR/230 LEGACY HOWEVER. ANYWAY, GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR DECISION.

[Master Yota]

I don't see why it wouldn't work. The NP200 is divorced, so technically it could be mounted behind the Jeep tcase to keep the drivelines happy. The Jeep tcase will have the speedo sensor to keep the computer happy - the NP200 speedo would still read on the dash to keep you informed. You've got all the wiring already, so its just a matter of hooking up the power and ground, and finding a safe weather free spot for the computer withing the available space dictated by the length of the harness. It might be a bit of a headache wiring it if you need more than the engine harness (ie. the engine computer talks to the chassis or body computer and whatnot...) but I'm sure its a solveable problem.

The newer 4 door JK jeeps are surprisingly heavy, so the strength of the drivetrain (trans and tcase) should stand up fairly well to the average use an M37 see's now a days. The 241R (from the rubicon) tcase is the same design as the 241 used behind the older cummins powered diesel trucks, just with a lower 4:1 low range gear set. Otherwise it'll be a NP231 tcase - which was used behind most dodge half ton trucks until recently. Tcase strength shouldn't be an issue. If its the 6spd manual trans, you'll probably get away with it, if your gentle. The previous 5spd is reputed to be a better unit. The auto's are fairly good, just put in a big cooler and thing twice about throwing 3 tons of cargo in the box.

Keep us posted...

[M42Dodge]

I own two Jeep JK 4dr Wranglers, both 2007 models with the smaller six Jeep uses now. Basically, the engine is very underpowered especially since I added some aftermarket bumpers and so forth. One jeep is stick and the other is an automatic and both are very week.

I pull a M416 trailer with the jeeps and when it is loaded and on the highway, it is just like driving the M37- SLOW.

It may be in the gearing but many Jeep JK owners are less than satisfied with the ablility of the stock engine. I never owned an engine that uses 5w-20 oil. It is like pouring water into the crackcase when I do an oil change. Tight tolerances for a basically weak engine.

The computer/processor situation would be a whole other can of worms...too much of it. Despite all that,
I hope you can pull off a swap and make it work...

TJ

[SOTVEN]

[quote="Master Yota"]I don't see why it wouldn't work. The NP200 is divorced, so technically it could be mounted behind the Jeep tcase to keep the drivelines happy. The Jeep tcase will have the speedo sensor to keep the computer happy - the NP200 speedo would still read on the dash to keep you informed.

SO MASTER YOTA, IF I GET YOUR POINT, YOU SUGGEST HE RUNS BOTH TRANSFER CASES IN A LINE?

[Tanner]

How will you handle the traction control/VSS inputs that the computer will be looking for? The emissions/evap system signals that the computer will be looking for? The fuel return line, unless it's a returnless single-line system? Do you have to integrate the 2010 Jeep dash panel in the event that the computer, again, is looking for signals...? Hello wiring nightmares...

And most Jeep owners I know all want the 4.0 straight-six back; the V6 is kind of crappy...

'Tanner'

[Master Yota]

I don't see why it wouldn't work. The NP200 is divorced, so technically it could be mounted behind the Jeep tcase to keep the drivelines happy. The Jeep tcase will have the speedo sensor to keep the computer happy - the NP200 speedo would still read on the dash to keep you informed.

SO MASTER YOTA, IF I GET YOUR POINT, YOU SUGGEST HE RUNS BOTH TRANSFER CASES IN A LINE?

You are correct Sotven... There is no reason why both tcase cannot be used. The NP200 dosen't know what it turning it, and the stock jeep case dosen't know whats comes after it.

As for Tanner pointing out the traction control inputs and VSS - the VSS is the "Vehicle Speed Sensor" which also generates the speedo signal and works in conjunction with the ABS brake sensors. There are ways to "modify" this programing in the computer, and worst comes to worse, it flashes a light on the dash. Anything can be made to work, even it means just unplugging the light bulb. As for routing extra fuel line to the gas tank - not really a big deal. Plus anything over 35 years old is generally air care exempt, so emisions issues shouldn't really be a problem either.

As for sluggish and slow - the 3.8 Jeep V6 makes 220hp, and 220lbs of torque. Its not low end torque, but comes on much higher in the rpm band. Offset that high rpm band with the low gears of the M37, and it sounds like it might make for a reasonable marriage. Eitherway, it'll still outperform the stock 230, and the 251.

If it can be made to work...

I recommend alot of research - and speak with some jeep engine transplant specialists, like those at American Expedition Vehicles - who pioneered the hemi into jeep swap a few years ago. They'll probably have the best information about the JK wiring and such.

Good luck!

[98taco3]

Thanks guys! The dash being needed is one question i had as well. It may be possible to just "hide" the jeep dash either WAY under the dashboard or somewhere else if space permits. Speed sensors wouldn't be TO difficult to rig up depending on how they work. If they are just hall effect sensors adding a mount and gear with the correct tooth number would be fairly easy. Im going to go take a look at it tomorrow and take some measurements and talk prices. Ill get some pictures of it and post em up. The engine has the automatic behind it unfortunately but that can most likely be solved fairly easily. I love the idea of the double transfer case! Talk about reduction!

[Tanner]

In some computer-controlled engine systems, you cannot simply 'pull the bulb' to kill the DTC's that the computer will toss up... it looks for the bulb in order to complete the circuit. Can you totally remove the factory computer & replace with Haltec/SDS/MegaSquirt/etc., aftermarket computer controls? Yes, of course you can, but what is the cost & learning curve in doing so? Steep...

In the 2010 Jeep application, the 3.8 is rated:
202 HP @ 5,200 rpm (153 kW)
237 Ft/Lb TQ @ 4,000 rpm (325 N•m)

Good luck in whatever direction you take -

'Tanner'

[Master Yota]

Thanks for the output correction Tanner.

[98taco3]

In some computer-controlled engine systems, you cannot simply 'pull the bulb' to kill the DTC's that the computer will toss up... it looks for the bulb in order to complete the circuit. Can you totally remove the factory computer & replace with Haltec/SDS/MegaSquirt/etc., aftermarket computer controls? Yes, of course you can, but what is the cost & learning curve in doing so? Steep...

In the 2010 Jeep application, the 3.8 is rated:
202 HP @ 5,200 rpm (153 kW)
237 Ft/Lb TQ @ 4,000 rpm (325 N•m)

Good luck in whatever direction you take -

'Tanner'

Ive looked into using megasquirt before and it will be the back up plan if this goes through. You can build a complete system for around $500 bucks if you buy the kit and assemble yourself. programming it would be a major issue but nothing that couldnt be worked out. 202hp would be more than enough considering the worn out 230 in it now pushes it alright. The added RPM range would be an advantage as well, just a bit more road speed. I would be happy to get it to 60 as right now it tops out about 45-50 and cant pull a hill without downshifting. To get anywhere in CO your driving more than a half hour so road speed, fuel mileage, and mountain drive-ability are going to be important. Ive been doing some looking around and it seems its possible the engine has a standard mopar bellhousing so transmission options may open up. Ill need to take some measurements but if a 5spd out of a 2wd dakota will be able to mate it would solve many problems.

[poor rich]

Don't forget the original transmission was very short, I looked at getting a 3.1? coupled to a 5 speed? from a dakota two weel drive for my "M". That transmission was almost 3 feet long.

Rich