Ain't these s'pose to be good in the snow?

[jim lee]

Two things finally happened at the same time. I got the M37 back on the road and it snowed. So this AM I decided to take my mighty 4x4 to work. Good lord! It didn't care if we were going forwards, sideways or backwards! Is this why I see pictures of people putting modern tires on these trucks? Do they really work that much better?

I ended up locking the front hubs and using 4x4 here and there just to keep moving.

-jim lee

[tbone1004]

running the NDT's? I'm sure they're ok in actual deep snow, but in the hardpack and on ice I wouldn't run with them... They act like hockey pucks. You can try tire chains, or even deflating them to get the pressure onto the outside edges would likely work a lot better. There's a reason mud tires are junk in the snow, and NDT's are basically mud tires. Modern snow tires have real small tread blocks that are spaced close together to actually grab and hold onto the snow since snow on snow has a lot higher coefficient of friction than rubber does. Siping may also help to accomplish the same thing. Even a set of chains on the front tires and running it in 4hi will get you better steering and stopping power. The back end will still be squirrely, but at least you can steer

[Master Yota]

NDT's have nothing in common with even a modern mud tire. The bias-ply construction of the NDT, coupled with a rubber compound that is so hard it virtually never wears out means that at any temperature lower than about 7*C its starting to loose traction on any hard surface. A modern radial mud tire will run circles around an NDT, under any driving conditions. And a modern winter rated tire will make the truck feel like its glued to the road.

Welcome to discovering why most folks who use their M37's in the winter either run chains or different tires. The NDT's suck. Plain and simple.

[52 M-42]

That's why I have one set of Super Lugs (for the street and ESPECIALLY WINTER) and one set of military NDTs for off road / fixed display. NDT's on wet / frozen roads are very scary. NDTs with chains are a real pain in the rear.

Super Lugs make it harder to steer, but they last longer and really grip the road.

52 M-42

[tbone1004]

I was just using them as a comparison for why they don't work well in the snow because mud tires don't offer any good snow traction at all because the lugs are so large and spaced far apart. The comparison was the big lugs+big spacing=good for shedding mud and bad for snow/wet conditions. Sorry for any confusion

[Master Yota]

I was just using them as a comparison for why they don't work well in the snow because mud tires don't offer any good snow traction at all because the lugs are so large and spaced far apart. The comparison was the big lugs+big spacing=good for shedding mud and bad for snow/wet conditions. Sorry for any confusion

While I do agree that mud tires aren't great for icy road use, the comparison is a little stilted. The real failure with the NDT isn't the open spacing of the outer lugs, but the unbroken center rib that has zero biting edges. That rib acts like a big slick, with zero ability to grab the road surface. That unbroken rib does play a large part in why NDT's never seem to wear out though, its a design that is shared by many high mileage tires. I've run super swampers in the winter without issue, other than I have to be present behind the wheel when driving, the auto-pilot function doesn't seem to work. I've got BFG KM2's on my daily driver right now, and I've got more than 3' of snow in the yard and they get around just fine. I do seem to use the 4wd button a little more, but so what, that's why I own a truck with a differential at both ends...

[RMS]

30 plus year old ndts are frightening in the wet west coast snow. the worst is a light dusting on narrow high crowned ditch lined roads. the winter before I got chains I got stuck on a slight incline. when I got out to asses the situation the 37 started sliding sideways, i pushed back and held the truck till it could be tied to two other trucks then assisted up the hill.
ndts and chains are awesome in deep snow, pushed through 3 to 4 ft for 50mile one February, it took 10 hours.
new ndts are not as frightening but you better be on your toes. I think ndts are the best high speed gravel tire. they smooth out washboard, dig when loaded cutting rails and at the same time step out nicely when prompted.

[Kaegi]

the only solution to drive on ice is to air down to 20 PSI or change the tires. I had Michelin XL 11.00 x 16s on a WC57 and I had to do the same thing with them. I was shocked how bad they were for a radial. airing down will make it perform like a tracked vehicle in comparison.

NDTs have a very tall bead and the lock ring on Dodges is an offroad design all engineered to be aired down to 20 psi.

[Brigand]

Not long ago I was discussing NDT's with a couple WWII vets. They said they would severely air down the tires on the WC's and jeeps when the ground got mucky with either snow or mud. They said the tires would get chewed up but it beat walking in that muck. Jack told me about appropriating an occasional team of plow horses as back up for when four wheel drive just wasn't enough.

[Master Yota]

Not long ago I was discussing NDT's with a couple WWII vets. They said they would severely air down the tires on the WC's and jeeps when the ground got mucky with either snow or mud. They said the tires would get chewed up but it beat walking in that muck. Jack told me about appropriating an occasional team of plow horses as back up for when four wheel drive just wasn't enough.

I'll second that approach. 20psi is still highway pressure in my opinion. 10-12psi is a good off road pressure for general use, and anything south of 10psi I would consider risky without bead locks. The upside to low pressure is the amount traction you can get on most surfaces; the downside is the door is either too close to or too far away to brace your feet on for leverage to turn the steering wheel.

Many folks run too much air in the their tires anyway. An empty truck doesn't need 50psi for running around on.